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EM. Why have you resuscitated the left-right, libertarian- authoritarian index which you introduced here some time ago? There is still an active discussion thread that you set up. Do you have shares?

Aug 19, 2018 at 7:46 PM | Unregistered CommenterSupertroll

Supertroll - my pleasure. I learned something.

Entropic Man - my score was:
Economic Left/Right: -3.0
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.0

Not sure what that says about me, though.

Aug 19, 2018 at 7:21 PM | Unregistered CommenterMark Hodgson

BBC2 now has a repeat of the Birmingham Clean air propaganda prog

Aug 19, 2018 at 6:11 PM | Registered Commenterstewgreen

Gwen. Thank you for the information upon my local nique. Is there some expectation that I will experience its insides firsthand?
When I first came to Norwich there was always a wonderful smell of chocolate from the local factory (not Frys). Long since closed.

Aug 19, 2018 at 2:44 PM | Unregistered CommenterSupertroll

Entropic Man
Thanks for that link.
Economic Left/Right: -1.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.56

My concern with the death penalty is executing an innocent person, especially one or the wrong race/religion or who supports a cause also supported by terrorists. Too easy for the majority to write it off as just one of those things

Aug 19, 2018 at 2:06 PM | Unregistered CommenterUibhist a Tuath

Supertroll, the tragedy of our penal system is recidivism. "Our" prison system is not significantly worse than the "best", and statistics produced are selectively biased anyway.

The Victorians built new and VASTLY improved prisons to some agreed principles of what "fair" treatment for prisoners involved, and how a purpose designed and engineered building complex could provide the correct environment for punishment AND correction.

Your local prison has a Wikipedia entry with this background and history:

"Norwich opened as a prison in 1887, on the site of the Britannia Barracks (the former home of the Royal Norfolk Regiment). The prison has had a variety of roles over the years, but today acts as a prison for Category B & C inmates. The impressive barrack block which stood behind the facade served as a Category C prison for some years from the 1970s but was demolished in the 1980s and replaced by a modern Category B prison block. The Victorian prison which stands at the end of Knox Road behind the old Barracks site was built in the mid-19th century as part of the reformation of the penal system brought about by the great prison reformers of that time. These included ★Elizabeth Fry.★"

"In January 2003 a report from Her Majesty's Chief Inspector of Prisons severely criticised Norwich Prison for factors including poor cleanliness and the failure of its anti-drug and anti-bullying programmes. The report also criticised the lack of work and education opportunities at the jail for inmates.[1]"

"In November 2004 the Prison Reform Trust criticised levels of overcrowding at Norwich Prison. The trust stated that nearly half of all single cells at the jail here holding two prisoners, and inmates were spending too much time locked up in their cells.[2]"

"At around this time Norwich became the only prison in England and Wales to have a unit exclusively for elderly male prisoners (mainly serving life sentences). This has meant that a number of high-profile elderly prisoners have been held at HMP Norwich in recent years."

Who was Elizabeth Fry?
Elizabeth Fry (née , often referred to as Betsy; 21 May 1780 – 12 October 1845) was an English prison reformer, social reformer and, as a Quaker, a Christian philanthropist. She has sometimes been referred to as the "angel of prisons".

Born Elizabeth Gurney 21 May 1780 ★Norwich★, England Died 12 October 1845 (aged 65)
Married Joseph Fry (m. 1800–1845) Quaker, Fry's CHOCOLATE!

"Fry was a major driving force behind new legislation to make the treatment of prisoners more humane, and she was supported in her efforts by Queen Victoria. She was depicted on the Bank of England £5 note from 2001-2016. Fry kept extensive and revealing diaries."

"She met Joseph Fry (1777–1861), a banker and part of the Fry's chocolate-making family, who was also a Quaker, when she was 20 years old. They married on 19 August 1800 at the Norwich Goat Lane Friends Meeting House and moved to St Mildred's Court in the City of London. Elizabeth Fry was recorded as a minister of the Religious Society of Friends in 1811."

Part of the Quaker/Christian/Victorian Chocalate Funded Fry's vision was that armed with a Bible and the solitude to read it, miracles of reform within well designed Prisons would occur. Personally, I find Fry's Turkish Delight more invigorating.

Isn't UEA built on chocolate money aswell?

Aug 19, 2018 at 1:24 PM | Unregistered Commentergolf charlie

Mark. Ah-hah so the problem is the way that a sentence is reported. Most of us assume that a six month sentence is six months in clink and then half is "forgiven" for good behaviour. I would prefer the judgement to be given and reported as three months in jail (with the possibility of a further 3 months for inappropriate behaviour). Lack of remorse or non disclosure could be grounds for remaining in jail.
Don't get me started on what half a life sentence actually means.
Thank you again.

Aug 19, 2018 at 12:24 PM | Unregistered CommenterSupertroll

May I reccomend the Polotical Compass website.

They suggest that you take their test, then read the analysis.

For comparison, I scored -2, -4 .

Aug 19, 2018 at 12:21 PM | Unregistered CommenterEntropic man

12pm LBC News report : Bob Ward just popped up to say
..'ooh drought scary, scary, be smart about water use'

... It is of course raining outside and the cut wheat field outside is about 7+ inches of lush green growth, as the past few weeks haven't been particularly dry.

Nothing on Twitter about him and water
The last Guardian article was
\\ Houses are being built today that will become ovens in future. @ret_ward on how the global housing affordability crisis and inadequate regulation may have deadly results //

Aug 19, 2018 at 12:06 PM | Registered Commenterstewgreen

Supertroll, I don't disagree with you! You might find this website useful:

It includes these snippets:

"Sentences are given to:

punish offenders
protect the public
change an offender's behaviour
ensure offenders do something to make up for their crime
reduce crime in the future"


"When an offender is given a determinate sentence, half of the sentence is served in custody and half of the sentence in the community.

Offenders sentenced to 12 months or longer in prison will be put on licence when they are serving the second part of their sentence. This licence is supervised by the Probation Service and includes conditions that offenders must meet, like not having contact with victims. If the offender doesn't meet the terms of their licence, they might have to go back to prison for the rest of their sentence.

Offenders sentenced to less than 12 months also serve the second half in the community but are not actively supervised by Probation.

If offenders commit another offence while they're serving the second half of their sentence, they may be sent back to prison. They will also be punished for the new offence. So offenders given determinate sentences always have to complete their full sentence. But half of it is in prison, and half of it is outside prison."

I hope that helps.

Aug 19, 2018 at 10:11 AM | Unregistered CommenterMark Hodgson

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