Bishop Hill Devil in the detail
There was some Twitter noise yesterday about fossil fuel subsidies, with various eco-activist types trying to drum up noise about doing away with them entirely. By an amazing coincidence, Christiana Figueres of the UNFCCC has today tweeted this:
All major economies have agreed to #EndFossilFuelSubsidies - this pledge now needs to be translated into action to fight #climatechange
This will no doubt be presented as a triumph for the green movement.
You have to laugh really. As Matt Sinclair tried valiantly to explain to Bob Ward yesterday, fossil fuel subsidies are something that happens mainly in the developing world, where they are seen as an aid to development. So when Ms Figueres says that "major economies" have agreed not to have fossil fuel subsidies, they are in fact agreeing to do something that they don't do, and moreover would never want to do, the oil industry being seen as a massive cash cow.
Reader Comments (19)
As I pointed out just recently myself.
The largest fossil fuel subsidies are in Iran: $100 billion a year until they startd to reform the system a year or two back. Followed by Saudi, Russia, Nigeria, Indonesia and so on.
Total amount is $450 billion or so.
Page 2 of this presentation is a little out of date but still useful.
http://www.iea.org/files/energy_subsidies_slides.pdf
In other news, swimmers agreed on a plan to not drown, dieters agreed on a plan to reduce calorie intake and everyone agreed that the sun will rise tomorrow morning.
#EndOilTaxation!
Cheaper Oil = More Transport Productivity! The lifeblood of the UK economy.
Barrel of oil extraction cost $50
Barrel Commodity price $100
Barrel UK pump price $300
So yes reduce the subsidy, opps there is no subsidy just a massive 'Green' tax.
The UK government has been completely merciless in extracting tax from motorists via fuel duty. The price of a litre of road fuel is about the same today as it was exactly 4 years ago. But then, the price of a barrel of Brent was $146 whereas today it is $96.
Not a single penny of the $50 fall in price per barrel has been passed on to motorists; it has all been seized by the Government.
#endfossilfuelsubsdies was a hash tag dreamed up by a bunch of teenage activists in Rio a couple of days ago to try and create a "twitterstorm".
It's pathetic that senior EU and UN figures like Figueres feel they need to join forces with activist groups to get their own way.
If we're going to have government by teenage activists - why do we need to pay millionaire bureaucrats like Figueres?
I posted on WUWT yesterday that anyone who comes across #endfossilfuelsubsidies on twitter should reply with #meaninglessgreendrivel (copyright J Lovelock)
The idea that fossil fuels are "subsidised" in the UK is a "canard" frequently to be encountered in the comment columns (and, inexcuseably, occasionally put forward by the environmental article editors and contributors) of the Guardian.
No matter how often this is raised and quashed whenever anyone complains about the very real subsidies presently pertaining to wind and solar...it refuses to die.
The huge quantities of tax already taken from us with respect to fuels generally always causes me to have a wry snarl whenever people call for a "carbon tax NOW!"
As mythical as Big Oil pay checks to the sceptical. The demons reside only in the head of the true fanatic while the rest of us can only watch and wonder.
These 'fossil fuel subsidies' in 1st world countries are a major article of faith in certain circles. What they are actually talking about is LIFO accounting and similar practices. Delusional.
Warren Meyer covers some of it here -
http://www.coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2011/08/wtf-this-is-what-they-mean-by-oil-and-gas-subsidies.html
Can they include negative subsidies, i.e. tax?
I've long been under the impression that Germany has - or had - a very protectionist stance on its coal industry, but whether that extends to actual subsidy I've no idea. Anyone know?
Last figures I found were for 3bn Euro annual subsidy to the coal industry in Germany. But that is more support for the communities (~30,000 workers), not really a subsidy on the price - importing from Australia would be cheaper. To be phased out by 2018.
How does Ms Figueres define a fossil fuel subsidy ? I seem to remember reading a while back that eco-zealots regard the 5% VAT on domestic energy as a subsidy on the grounds that VAT on most other goods and services is 20%. A bit of semantic gymnastics, perhaps, but I don't trust these people.
(Of course, this ignores the fact that electricity from fossil fuels, once fed into the grid, is indistinguishable from electricity from any other source.)
About "green jobs":
Failures:
Beacon Power
Bright Automotive
Eastern Energy
Ener1
Energy Conversion Devices
Evergreen Solar
Mountain Plaza
Olson's Crop Service
Photowatt
Q-Cells
Range Fuels
Siag
Solar hybrid
Solar Trust of America
Solar Millenium
Solarday
Solon
Solyndra
Sovello
Spectrawatt
Unisolar
In bad or very bad shape:
A123 Systems
Abound Solar
Alterra Power
Amonix
Brightsource Energy
Enel Green Power
Fisker Automotive
First Solar
Nevada Geothermal
Nordex
NRG Energy
Phoenix solar
Solarworld
Sunpower Corp
The Bard Group
BitBucket,
The German coal subsidies were to have been phased out by 2012! I guess the target is like, well, a mirage: as one gets closer, it moves farther away.
I checked EU coal subsidies a couple of months back, and Spain had approval for them too. But then oyu might argue that they are not a 'major economy'. And if Germany keeps having to bail out the PIGS, they might cease to be one.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territorial_disputes_of_Nicaragua
http://www.ticotimes.net/Current-Edition/News-Briefs/Costa-Rica-VP-denounces-Nicaragua-at-climate-change-talks_Thursday-December-09-2010
What is the difference between Christina Figueres and Ashley and Pudsley The dancing dog act that won Britains Got Talent
Most people were able to vote for the dancing dog act
Everyone on Tweeter send Christina a simple tweet
Now she can dictate goverment socal and energy policy not just ours and everyone elses that have all been democratically elected
Ask her this question
Christina who ever voted for you ?
A question they will be asking in Nicaragua
It took the murder of an American TV Reporter to get rid of their evil brutal dicator
But the outside foreign interferance is still there
Will they all agree to end renewable energy subsidies as well ??? Pigs might fly !! But I have to congratulate the UK for planning to reduce subsidies of some wind farms by 25% ---is this definite or just a bright idea at this stage.
"Subsidies" to the fossil fuel industry in the first world are the tax deductions they get on drilling expenses etc., including mineral right purchases. The Eco-Green see these as different from the tax deductions the renewables get AND the additional revenues the renewables electricity collects from the State.
The fossil fuel industry has been operating on borrowed money for so long that it is difficult to say what the true profits are. Yeah, share values go up (and down) but when you see how often in the past the business has invested >100% of cash flow (share offerings and bank debt), you might conclude that there is very little profit in EXPLORING for oil and gas.
Which is true. There are large profits in producing reserves once they have been found and put on production. "Operating" profits are high. But that number disguises a lot of cost in the background that has been enabled by debt (including share offerings) financing.
The Eco-Greens just need to kill the tax deductions if they want to kill the fossil fuel industry. But they will never kill the subsidies to renewables, if they are allowed the option. Oil is evil, sunshine and wind are good.
Is this how civilizations end? One regulation and obstruction at a time?
The fact that aviation fuel is not taxed is viewed by many greens as a fuel subsidy.