Bishop Hill Some correspondence with Norfolk Police
Dec 9, 2010 Climate: CRU 
A few people have been wondering how Norfolk Constabulary have been getting on with their investigation into the leak/hack at UEA. I had been wondering the same thing myself, and just before the Climategate anniversary, I wrote to the to see how things were coming along. I had had some prior dealings with Norwich's finest at the time of Climategate, when the force's media office had helpfully sent some press releases to me. This meant I had a named contact I could approach directly.
My first letter went out on 5th November:
Dear HarryWe are shortly heading for the anniversary of the Climategate affair and I was wondering whether you will be releasing a statement on the progress of the investigation. In particular, it would be good to know if the investigation has determined whether the offence being investigated was a hack or a leak.CheersAndrew
Three days later, I'd heard nothing, so I wrote again:
Dear Harry
Just wondered if I could get a response to this inquiry.
The following day, Harry came good:
Hi Andrew, apologies for the delay, I have asked Nicola in my team to chase the officers for a statement that marks the anniversary. Nicola will be in touch shortly. I know she has put the request in and that she’s waiting back a response. Thanks Harry
By the end of the month, I'd heard nothing at all, so I wrote to Harry once again.
Did anything ever appear here? I didn't see anything.
Thanks
A couple of hours later, I got a reply:
No, nothing has appeared to date and we have had no recent requests for a statement.
This was rather strange, in a "par for the course for dealing with civil servants" kind of way. One would have assumed that Harry might have seen my approach as a "request for a statement". However, just to be sure I replied as follows:
Could you please issue a statement on the progress of the investigation.
Thanks
Despite sending a reminder, there has been no response as yet.
Reader Comments (47)
perhaps an FOI request?
This sounds like the usual bureacratic run-around. Try writing again, copy to the Chief Constable.
Not sure that this is succeptible to FoI.
An FOI for costs to date? If compared to the previous figure you got this would be an indication of the level of activity.
If you need to send a further reminder, I suggest the subject line is
Harry read me
Ben, that is brilliant!
LOL @ Ben.
Maybe their systems have been "hacked" and the investigations files stolen...
I wonder what level of expertise the Norfolk Old Bill has at it's beck and call.
By the way Ben... nice suggestion. Beer over the Ipad time!
Maybe Norfolk folk don't like giving out information to strangers. "Ye are not from these parts - arrrr uuuu? Ohh arr, ohh arr!"
The only information I ever received from country folk was the quickest way out of the village.
Maybe Norfolk police should get in touch with the Metropolitan police, as they have the culprit in custody already.
Julian Assange has already confessed in front of over 300 journalists, see:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=W17dW_aJEwU
Not only does he say that wiki leaks were responsible for the actual hack, he goes on (in hysterically wrong detail) about why climate gate was just a storm in a teacup and in fact showed that climate scientists were good, honest, decent and true. And they all had nice haircuts and were kind to small animals. (Okay, I made that last bit up)
The best bit is that absolutely nobody questions him. They're all too busy having orgasms.
It's a fair cop, Gov.
Surely UEA should be making such a request to the local police, assuming they would want any illegal activity and potential culprits to be dealt with. Given the damage this event has done to their reputation, and probably their income stream, this cannot be a matter they would be happy to see just fade away.
This might sound really odd, but the inside word from an intelligence service from a non-English speaking country far from GB, shall we say Country X, is that Country X are confident they know the identity of the employed person who released the data and the reasons why. However, the person in Country X who passed this on does not wish any more to be said, insinuating that the individual deserves reward.
If you were the individual, you would possibly plan a tactic that protected you to some extent. For example, the Wikileaks guy says he has worse to come if people wish to victimise him. That might be a fear that is staying the hand of Harry the Plod, if he has got as far as working out who it was.
OTOH, this might all be utter garbage.
By coincidence I emailed their press office recently asking for some statement / clarification on whether it was a hack or a release from inside. Needless to say zero response. My next step was to go straight to the Chief Constable.
However, if I recall at the time of the email release there were initial stories in the papers that the emails were put on a public drive on the UEA network, which meant there was easy access. These stories quick disappeared and the "hack" theory quickly took over. The silence from Inspector Knacker seems very odd as our computer geeks at work tell me that a hack would be detectable almost immediately by any network administrator.
Eventually, after much foot dragging, the report will appear...
"Sorry. Even after spending a million and a half quid on the investigation, we could not find out anything at all. Thank you very much for all the overtime and Good Night!"
If all else fails get Wikileaks on the case !
Here's another named source on the Andrew Revkin blog post of the time...
"I asked Tuesday morning for an update on the case and Jonathan Dack, a spokesman, forwarded a reply you can read below, along with comments on the status of the criminal case from several of the scientists whose communications were prominently featured in the batch of released material."
It's interesting to review replies to Revkin from the scientists now the dust has settled.
Maybe if Norfolk receive a few more updated "recent requests for a statement" from the likes of the Telegraph and NY Times they will oblige. I wonder, would they get away with giving the same run around to the mainstream press as they do to the folks paying their wages?
I presume that the moment that the Police give up the filestore will be returned to UEA. Is there any way to prevent them destroying the evidence?
Does anybody know the whereabouts of Keith Briffa?
http://www.norfolk.police.uk/idoc.ashx?docid=ae9201f8-952f-4325-8933-40bb97b29dbc&version=1
"Norfolk Old Bill"
Nice acronym!
lol Dave
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Maybe it's because I am China and in the bar!
Peter Hayes - "Maybe it's because I am China", sure sounds like you are having fun but better not send any emails to the wife....:o)
@ Mac "The only information I ever received from country folk was the quickest way out of the village."
LOL
I used to live in a village. They must have liked you. If they didn't, you would still be looking for a way out.
"No, nothing has appeared to date and we have had no recent requests for a statement."
Not according to Norfolk Constabulary Disclosure log
unless we're getting into new definitions of "recent".
I see no-one in the Norfolk investigation team bought your book with official coffers either Bish, shame.
curses the lack of an edit function!
http://www.norfolk.police.uk/aboutus/yourrighttoinformation/freedomofinformation/disclosurelog.aspx?category=Investigations&year=2010
Frosty, I had not realized that the Constabulary posted the FoI requests. You can see two of mine there:
July: Request for the number of copies of 'The Hockey Stick Illusion' held and purchased by the Norfolk Constabulary
October: Enquiry regarding books held by the Constabulary in connection with the investigation at the University of East Anglia Climatic Research Unit
I think that if the Constabulary were conducting a real investigation, they would have read some of the books that have been published about Climategate.
Norfolk Constabulary Disclosure log October 2010
Request Details: Information relevant to the current status of investigations in relation to the University of East Anglia - Climate Research Unit
Release Details: Released in full
I nominate Ben for Wit of the Week. Harry Read Me. Brilliant!
(continued)
"Norfolk Constabulary continues with its major investigation into alleged criminal offences around a data breach at the University of East Anglia. Detailed enquiries are ongoing and officers have been working with various specialist organisations and the UEA to take the investigation forward. It would be inappropriate for us to comment any further at this stage"
I didn't know either doug. Once I read the link Chris posted, which stated it would be published on their website, I had to use the FOI number in a search of their site.
There is a direct link to the disclosure log on their website, I failed to find it until I hit site map, in there hidden in the "about us" dialogue is a direct link.
I think that if they were conducting a real investigation, it would have been done and dusted, and we'd know weather someone took it off a public server or not within weeks.
FWIW - WhatDoTheyKnow is a good resource for managing and sharing FOI requests and info:
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/search/norfolk%20police/bodies
Does anyone have an email address for the Norfolk investigation team? They sent me a letter to Oz by snail mail about eight months ago suggesting that because I had requested confidentiality agreements for four countries, I might possibly be implicated in the heinous theft. They gave an email address but unfortunately I utilise the CRU data management system and have lost the letter.
If someone can send me an email address, I will respond. My input may provide the missing link in this lengthy and difficult investigation.
Thanks
NB: I found the above link by searching the site for UEA - only about 20 results, and that was the only relevant one.
I asked in October and recieved this back....
Dear Mr. Reed
Due to Data Protection laws, I am unable to advise when this report will be released.
Regards
Norfolk Constabulary
Contact & Control Room
OCC
Falconers Chase
Wymondham
Norfolk
NR18 0WW
Tel: 0845 456 4567
Fax: 0845 345 4567
SMS: 07786 200 777
Minicom: 0845 345 3458
Email: enquiries@norfolk.pnn.police.uk
-----------------------------
From: alandreed@tiscali.co.uk
Sent: 2010/10/14 10:07:31
To: OCC - Norfolk Police Enquiries <Contact@norfolk.pnn.police.uk>
Subject: Climatic Research Unit
Sirs,
I understand that, since last year, you have been investigating
the release of emails from the institution above.
Are you able to say
when a report of the findings of this investigation will be published?
Thanks and regards,
Alan D Reed
Sorry for the name mistake Dave, someone called Chris rang me while I was posting :)
Good job I wasn't ironing at the time! :^)
Nature's David Adam recently wrote:
"Although the police and the university say only that the investigation is continuing, Nature understands that evidence has emerged effectively ruling out a leak from inside the CRU, as some have claimed."
If the police aren't making statements, perhaps David Adam obtained his 'understanding' from the CRU?
"unfortunately I utilise the CRU data management system and have lost the letter"
All is explained...
Why am I not surprised? You would have hoped that you would have at least gotten the usual copper line of "Nothing here, move alone!"
Or perhaps that would have been the truth?
Loved the "Harry read me" line too.
Frosty
"Good job I wasn't ironing at the time"
LOL!
Somehow, it's hard to imagine a warmist making such a remark. I'm not sure they do self-deprecation...
Stuck-record
“Not only does [Assange] say that wiki leaks were responsible for the actual hack..”
That sounds like the ‘Wilt defence’ in which Henry Wilt confesses to a heinous crime (disposing of his wife in the meat factory responsible for the detective’s favourite pies) that he can disprove later, and gets the CID off his back for a decent spell. Just a thought...
Frosty>
"Sorry for the name mistake Dave, someone called Chris rang me while I was posting :)"
Not to worry, Dave isn't my real name in any case :)
You know guys, I’m not sure the person who distributed the Climategate files would appreciate your attempts to spur the Norfolk police into action. Wind them up enough and you might just get a result.
Dec 9, 2010 at 10:41 AM Mactheknife said “However, if I recall at the time of the email release there were initial stories in the papers that the emails were put on a public drive on the UEA network, which meant there was easy access. These stories quick disappeared and the "hack" theory quickly took over.”
I think that referred to an earlier “leak” that Steve McIntyre teased Phil Jones with. It was Mr Jones himself who accidentally put data on a public area of the server.
http://climateaudit.org/2009/07/25/a-mole/
http://climateaudit.org/2009/07/28/met-officecru-finds-the-mole/
The story continues on the following posts.
JP That reminds me of a play on the old werewolf joke...
I used to be a Warmist, but I'm ch ch ch ch ch chilled out now :^)
It's like in "The Big Lebowski", when the Dude's car gets stolen and he asks the cop at the impound yard "do you have any leads?"
The cop laughs. "Leads? Oh yeah, we're doin' nothin' else but look for the punks that trashed your car, pal! (chuckle) Leads..."
The Indian bureaucrats (including the police) learned some tricks of of the trade from their British colonial masters before 1947. Today they are much more sophisticated, and this kind old fashioned "mum is the word" does not cut it any more. Maybe Norfolk could send some officers over here and together with our cops they can cook up some distracting plot story or lead the investigation publicly into an "acceptable" dead end.
perhaps I should send a copy of the Australian analysis of Climate Gate e-mails.It is a compelling read.
Fredericka