Josh 59

Comments

[Phillip Bratby]

Great.

Josh, I see on WUWT that you are asking for suggestions for change. I suggest you show some big cracks and bends in the legs, with a bit of a tilt on the table top.

In fact thinking about it, you could develop this into a time sequence, with the last one being a heap of debris.

[Frosty]

Like the theme Josh :)

You could have a great big 'Null Hypothesis' crack running through the table - or an overbearing Svensmark towering over the whole thing with a great big hammer :)

On the Co2 leg, you could have some scaffolding of indoctrination holding it up, maybe a vostock crack in it too.

Or another table under-construction - made from bricks of MWP,LIA, etc.

or back to Panto.... a straw table of CAGW, a wooden table of AGW, and a brick tabel of Null hypothesis with the big bad wolf svensmark blowing the first two away :)

[Frosty]

somehow, the whole thing needs to balance of a crumbling fulcrum of GCMs

[andyscrase]

This is starting to look like one of those Escher illusions, like the never ending staircase of funding...

[Frosty]

Steve Mc Canadian Beaver chewing chunks out the leg....

I'll be here all week :¬)

[Anoneumouse]

@ Josh

How about an IPCC table cloth

[riskaverse]

Love it though I would have though that a leg made of Bristle Cone Pine might be appropriate.

[RETEPHSLAW]

And at the end of it all, a shot (rear view) of Steptoe & Son as they leave on their horse and cart with the remains of the table and a broken AGW sign on board.

PW

[Josh]

Great ideas! IPCC table cloth, very funny. And I like the idea of doing a sequence.

Many thanks.

[Budgie]

I like it, simple enough for me to grasp.

However slightly off topic what concerns me is the way the CAGW supporters constantly change their tune. According to them their every pronouncement is absolute fixed consensus and true science, where detractors are just malevolent or ignorant or both. Yet over the years: CO2 > GHG; GW > 'climate change'; CO2 swamps every other factor > other factors can swamp CO2.

[Barry Woods]

A good one for Josh to get his teeth into:

Last years pre COP 15 6 feet (2m) alarmism has been officially called wrong by the Met Office.

Alarmist Doomsday warning of rising seas 'was wrong', says Met Office study

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1335964/Alarmist-Doomsday-warning-rising-seas-wrong-says-Met-Office-study.html#ixzz17KZaXtHJ

[BBD]

@ Barry Woods

Thanks for the link. From the DM article:

The former deputy prime minister, who was involved in negotiating the original climate treaty in Kyoto, says he will present a “Prescott Plan” to break the deadlock between rich and poor countries.

Prepare for the end, fellow citizens. If it's come to this, we really are doomed.

[j ferguson]

What is a Prescott Plan? What is shoogle?

[Don Pablo de la Sierra]

andyscrase
This is starting to look like one of those Escher illusions, like the never ending staircase of funding...

I didn't know that Escher did THIS

But it is an example to which you allude, I believe.

[BBD]

@ j ferguson

Shoogle can mean 'rocky' as in a table with odd-length legs.

http://www.earlyworkspress.co.uk/shoogle.htm

John Prescott is a bit harder to deal with. You are obviously not a hapless resident of the benighted UK or you wouldn't need to ask.

JP is a former Labour Party politician with a notorious habit of talking b******s in impenetrably convoluted syntax. He is/was not exactly popular.

The idea of the fate of the planet depending on a 'Prescott Plan' is at once absolutely hilarious and utterly terrifying.

[j ferguson]

BBD,
Re: the Prescott Plan. Do you think they are serious, or is it a subtle prod?

[BBD]

J ferguson

First, apologies - I gave you the wrong link for 'shoogle' above. It should have been this:

http://www.stooryduster.co.uk/pages02/shoogle.htm

As for the Prescott Plan, a part of me hopes that it is just a desperate, last-ditch bid by the shadowy figures behind the scenes in the UNFCCC to get something - anything - substantive out of COP16.

Essentially along the lines of 'so, a 4C thermageddon by mid-century not scary enough to stop the bickering is it? Right then. Time for the Prescott Plan!'

Or it could just be a very funny joke.

Josh? Are you out there...?

[Chuckles]

Love the earlier suggestions, but the whole thing needs a couple of coats of whitewash.

[Don Pablo de la Sierra]

Josh

You forgot the Hockey Stick (perhaps as a leg).

Don't you love all these wanna be cartoonists? :)

Keep up the great work!

[ZT]

I am picturing a frozen Kev, in a wintry Dickensian act of desperation, about to smash the table for firewood with an axe ...

...the ghosts of winters past: Hansen, Schmidt, and creepy Phil are goading him on.

[golf charley]

Prescott Plan
This may involve the political elite puting on weight during the good years, through greed, conspicuous consumption and lack of exercise, and wanting to maintain that differential as the proletariat that paid for it all, go hungry through the lean years

[BBD]

golf charley

There's a certain irony in non other than Two Jags himself getting up on his hind legs to rescue COP16.

[Richard]

That should be a 3 – legged table. The CO2 level increase and Fossil Fuel CO2 should be combined into one leg.

Then take away one leg – The Significance of CO2 and Water Vapour, falling into the crevasse of "observations" that forms on the melting ice or ground of "theory", [this bit thanks to tallbloke] and the table doesnt have a leg to stand on.

[Phillip Bratby]

A great idea of Peter Walsh:

at the end of it all, a shot (rear view) of Steptoe & Son as they leave on their horse and cart with the remains of the table and a broken AGW sign on board.

With luck you can date it 2011.

[bobby]

I see wikileaks has finally got around to the global warming scam

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/dec/06/wikileaks-rajenendra-pachauri-iran-un-climate

[Neal Asher]

Something else to chuckle at:
Hugo Chavez: Climate change ‘due to criminal capitalism’
http://news.scotsman.com/news/Hugo-Chavez-Climate-change-39due.6650851.jp?CommentPage=1&CommentPageLength=1000

[j ferguson]

What? It's not a periodic table?

[BBD]

@ Neal Asher

I laughed (well, not much actually) this time last year at Hugo Chavez's standup turn at COP15:

One could say, Mr. President, that a spectre is haunting Copenhagen, to paraphrase Karl Marx, the great Karl Marx, a spectre is haunting the streets of Copenhagen, and I think that spectre walks silently through this room, walking around among us, through the halls, out below, it rises, this spectre is a terrible spectre almost nobody wants to mention it: Capitalism is the spectre, almost nobody wants to mention it.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=16615

The song remains the same: looney tunes.

[RoyFOMR]

"Hugo Chavez: Climate change ‘due to criminal capitalism’"
Hold that thought Mr President.
Ms Gaia and I can call her that, despite all her false suitors and pretend husbands, has seen it all.
The first signs of life took a while. The first traces of intelligence followed shortly afterwards.
Evidence of increased intelligence is currently not on her radar.
Plain stupidity is, however, currently apparent. Four and a bit billion years Anno Gaia later and you take us back to the starting point.
Happy Dumb Day, Mr President
Happy Dumb Day to you!

[Paul]

Thought I'd sign up to feedburner Climate Change sceptic blog alerts the other day. Strewth the list is long. So I've been asked to comment on various blogs on the subject. Well here I am, as this blog was amongst the list, and I'm not exactly sure which side of the argument they want me to take. I presume they merely want the subject to be discussed in a rational and as scientific way as possible but I must admit to finding this difficult seeing the evidence not exactly going the way of those who believe in AGW. Any suggestions would be helpful.

[Atomic Hairdryer]

More climate capitalism picked up by the Daily Mail

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1336246/Britain-needs-20-000-wind-turbines-stick-green-targets.html

Britain 'needs 20,000 more wind turbines to stick to green targets'

Business guru Lord Turner, chairman of the Committee on Climate Change, said the UK had to slash greenhouse gas emissions by 60 per cent by 2030 to help tackle global warming.

..He added: ‘Any less ambition would not be compatible with the 2050 target in the Climate Change Act. We therefore urge the Government to legislate the budget we have recommended.

So not really to help tackle global warming, but to meet government and presumably windmill maker's targets. The price? A mere £30bn a year or 1% of GDP which will be paid for by new environmental taxes and higher energy bills. Which presumably will have no impact on GDP or energy poverty, at least not for those trousering the £30bn a year.

Also in light of Hancock's little problem, the CCC's 4th budget link is currently broken and redirects to-

http://thecccdev.heymoscow.com/carbon-budgets

Perhaps an unfortunate choice of web host, or an indication that economic warfare is worse than we thought.

[Atomic Hairdryer]

Re Paul

So I've been asked to comment on various blogs on the subject.

Curious who by and why? Is this another CACC-style rapid rebuttal scheme?

I must admit to finding this difficult seeing the evidence not exactly going the way of those who believe in AGW. Any suggestions would be helpful.

Keep looking at the evidence, not the PR :)

AGW and CAGW though are very broad churches and cover pretty much the whole gamut of science, economics, politics, psychology and religion. There's a lot to learn and it can be fun to learn about, so my advice would be to focus on aspects that interest you. If you want a good backgrounder covering a lot of the historical aspects, both in temperature terms and personalities, the Bishop's book is well worth reading. Jo Nova's Sceptics Handbook is also a good backgrounder from the sceptical pov-

http://joannenova.com.au/global-warming/

Read that, find areas which intrigue or puzzle you, research them and have fun. To paraphrase Joe Bastardi, enjoy the climate, it's the only one we've got. Outside of computer simulations that is.

[James P]

Paul

"I presume they merely want the subject to be discussed in a rational and as scientific way as possible"

I'm not at all sure they do...

[James P]

j.ferguson

Thanks for the 'shoogle' explanation. Not familiar to some of us Southerners.

I liked your 'periodic table', too.. :-)

[j ferguson]

James P,
Twasn't me on shoogle' but BBD. We scots crossed the pond in 1830's and the only scottishism which came down to me was "Nibby, nibby, nok, which hand d'ye tok, ye can't beguile me?" to guess which hand behind the back holds the goody.

Shoogle will be added to skiver as words learnt since then.

[James P]

JF

Sorry, it was you asking, I realise - I wasn't brave enough!

Although I have some Scotch blood in my veins, I've been an effete Southerner for long enough to appreciate PG Wodehouse's clear distinction between a Scotsman with a grievance and a ray of sunshine...

[Chuckles]

Might be good to have a gravy boat or some instant gravy mix in there somewhere as well?

[James P]

And a train set? Poor Josh...

[j ferguson]

Chuckles,

Gravy boat is very good. Methinks Josh needs a bigger table.

[Paul]

Sorry I was trying my best to be ironic when I spoke about the feedburner climate change link (I can't remember where I picked up the link in the first place) but yes it is a rebuttal service for the warmists so that they can hijack comment threads such as yours using the army of useful idiots. Just sigh up and they send you a list of current blogs where you go and do your best to put their side of the argument.
I'll try to locate the link if possible.

[James P]

"a rebuttal service for the warmists"

A strange thing to need if their arguments are as persuasive as they keep telling us. As Piet Hein once wrote: "truth is constructed in such a way that it can't be exaggerated".

[BBD]

James P

Good Piet Hein quote. Must remember that.

[Paul]

Found it. Sign up here and you will recieve near daily updates on current blog comments and news stories where you can put the warmist side of the debate.

http://www.campaigncc.org/node/384

[Timberati]

Josh might consider having the CO2 leg of natural variation shimmed with a magazine marked "fossil fuel consumption." According to John Christy: that 98.5 per cent (210 billion metric tons) of carbon dioxide entering the atmosphere comes from natural sources in the world’s carbon cycle, while we humans add only 1.5 per cent (3.2 billion metric tons) to the total. The figures may have moved somewhat since Christy's writings but the fact remains; it's mostly natural variation.