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Discussion > Smart Meters

It's all about control. The progressive term 'smart', used so blithely, is very apt. The business end of the whip does smart. It snaps, it crackles, it pops.

May 4, 2017 at 3:33 AM | Unregistered Commenterkim

Yeah, g, I've long maintained that we need to worry when our energy footprint is measured, metered, and taxed, not just our carbon footprint.

May 4, 2017 at 9:01 AM | Unregistered Commenterkim

Stew, I had not noticed the date on the original article but his more recent one from January of last year (UK Parliament calls for Evidence on Smart Metering Programme) makes it clear that the slow-motion train wreck is still heading our way.

May 4, 2017 at 11:15 AM | Registered Commentermikeh

June 2017 What's new
- Queens Speech seemed to include bill to delay SM implimenttation until 2025*
but that was a COULD not DID
actually the new bill would give the gov the right to move the deadline upto 5 years

- BBC Watchdog did a segment exposing serious new danger.
Britishgas smartmeter implementation includes gas meters, short of installation technicians means things are slipping
eg the meter washer was left off and the family got home to find a flat filled with gas
...Happened more than once.

- Smets2 meters are still not ready some point all the X million Smets1 need to be ripped out and replaced.

Jun 30, 2017 at 10:31 PM | Registered Commenterstewgreen

@colinsmith pointed us to the Nick Hunn 2016 powerpoint
"I found this in refreshing my memory that they do not deliver the savings predicted/projected.
i.e. they're yet another white elephant being expensively sacrificed on the altar of the Church of anti-CO2."

* Hunn paraphrases the EU 2020 Directive
as does the BBC "The EU has said that all its members must provide smart meters by 2020 as long as there is a positive economic case to do so." - BBC background story : March
- E&T Background May says "at least 80 per cent of households by 2020 wherever it is cost-effective to do so.
Compared with equivalent projects elsewhere in Europe, the cost of the British programme appears high."

\\Martyn Allen from charity Electrical Safety First, which sits on the national smart meter secretariat, declares it “inevitable” that the 2020 deadline would not be met, as supply companies require “a whole army” of installers to complete the herculean task.//

"The German parliament has mandated installation of smart meters in a modest 23 per cent of homes."
Why is the UK targetting 100% by 2020 then ?

Jun 30, 2017 at 10:44 PM | Registered Commenterstewgreen

I like the Nick Hunn report
BUT I'm suspicious as to him not mentioning any positives at all

#1 Like if you put up a brand new estate block is it not good to implement remote meter reading tech ?

#2 Why's Hunn not also campaign against renewables like solar/wind ?

Jun 30, 2017 at 10:55 PM | Registered Commenterstewgreen

Why do UK politicians badly implement engineering stuff.
It's like you leave the kids to do something and then come back and they screwed it up.

#1 Renewables ..super idiotic implementations
I'd always imagined that polits would help gas power companies implement wind/solar so that those corps kept feeding out the same power and saved money on the gas.
- But no the gov implemented subsidies and market priorities for SEPARATE wind/solar corps
Result anyone running a gas power plant loses market share but still has the same fixed costs.... so then himself asks for subsidies.

#2 Smart Meters
Governments overall intention is to REDUCE overall electric consumption
So they give the job to electric sales corps whose best way to profits is to INCREASE overall electric consumption

Also Polits don't seem to have thought of SMART ways
eg1 Focus on easiest to install first new build then flats , then uban, and just forget about everyone in villages
eg 2 Hookup so that guy who does the smart meter does 2 jobs
eg tie it in to fibre installation so the guy install your home fibre and does smart meter
or the guy who comes to service your boiler gets £20 to install your smartmeter at the same time.

PS Why do smart meters use cellphone or radio tech
What about Broadband over power lines tech ? to send the info instead to the substation.
Like the substations are already wired into the grid info system so a home only has to get its info as far as the substation.

Jun 30, 2017 at 11:25 PM | Registered Commenterstewgreen

Why do UK politicians badly implement engineering stuff?

There was a little general knowledge test sent out to MPs some years ago (possibly 20 years...) Multiple choice - the "temperature of boiling water" was one question that defeated more than 50% if I recall correctly.

One thing that drives competence at a task is the possible uncomfortable consequences of getting it very, very wrong - from what I can see the political class and their supporting administrators have cleverly removed the sticks and are simply gorging on the carrots.

There are very, very few engineers in politics and very few in the supporting cadres of senior civil servants - which must in large part explain the stupendous credulity that both groups regularly display regarding that sort of stuff. They don't know how things work - or what they cost - or how long it'll take to do (roughly) - the ignorance is balanced by their hubris ... which overbalances into huge projects where few know how the project actually was conceived and what the actual desired outcome is...

Jun 30, 2017 at 11:38 PM | Registered Commentertomo

Jun 30, 2017 at 11:38 PM | tomo

The easiest thing for the Politicians and Political classes, is simply to think and vote the way they are told.

Jun 30, 2017 at 11:46 PM | Unregistered Commentergolf charlie

Nick Hunn's website: (of course!)
You could ask him his views on other subjects.
My thought, having skimmed his "about" page, is he's an electronics engineer who has come into smart meters peripherally from his wireless comms background and has that terminal curiosity that afflicts many engineers (me too!).
On your comment on unthreaded about how long he has been questioning smart meters:
Isn't that the way with many issues. Someone happens to notice and goes, hang on a minute, that's not right while the rest of the world has an enormous inertia that takes a lot to divert.
Sounds familiar? I'm looking at you global warming/climate change/climate chaos.

Jul 1, 2017 at 10:16 AM | Unregistered Commentercolin smith

OK a couple of extra Qns for BEIS civil servants.
#1 Good practice is to a regional pilot study first.why not with SM ?
#2 Where's the targeting ? It's no use bothering with granny flats.
Medium businesses should be first target.
I'd recruit energy waste inspectors who'd earn commission based on how much energy they saved a business ..theyd root out the biggest waste.

#3 Why not build the SM into the distribution board ?
that way it would display electric use in each ring main and lighting circuit etc .

Jul 1, 2017 at 3:20 PM | Registered Commenterstewgreen

Some stuff from unthreaded etc ..

Investing in Smart Meters - h/t Bish on Twitter An "investment opportunity" that seems to indicate each one costs ca. £420 but doesn't indicate if they're installing "dumb" smart meters ...

A youtube video detailing the contortions required for a user to configure / make sense of a smart gas meter

Jul 15, 2017 at 5:58 AM | Registered Commentertomo

Apparently they are still installing the obsolete ones that cannot communicate with a new provider if you switch supply in the knowledge that they will have to replace them when the new model is released. There are still doing TV ads all the time which must be expensive. Never mind, it's only tax payers' money.

Jul 16, 2017 at 5:17 PM | Unregistered CommenterSchrodinger's Cat