Thursday
Dec082011
by 
Bishop Hill
Bishop Hill Windy days
Dec 8, 2011 Energy: wind Scotland Wind turbines Bit windy here at the moment. I wonder how the windfarms are getting on?
Not too well it seems.
H/T Mrs Hill and commenters on unthreaded.
Reader Comments (76)
These turbine failures occurred on land sites where crews could get to them to fix things. Now let's imagine putting these installations in the middle of the North Sea, one of the most hostile marine environments known.
Oddly, Newsnight last night slipped betwen fair reporting to misleading reportage in a matter of seconds.
The presenter (Kirsty Wark?) started on the storms and made it very clear that they were in no way linked to AGW, then we saw a few clips of hurricane force winds interspersed with a clip of a windfarm operating properly (presumably taken on another day).
Are they teetering towards balance or was it just a temporary blip?
Just to follow up on yesterdays comments on wind generation forecasts -
The original forecast for wind power capacity today was 3749MW. The 'latest firecast' is approx 2300MW and the actual generation at present (and for the past few hours) is approx 1600MW.
Worth noting that up to yesterday the total metered capacity was around 3750MW, today it's at 4006MW so looks like another wind farm or so has been added.
figures from: http://www.bmreports.com/bsp/bsp.php
Whoops! Cold fingers made a typo in the above. (But maybe 'firecast' was more accurate!)
@Dec 8, 2011 at 9:16 PM | Don Pablo de la Sierra
"This is going to be a very interesting weekend. Hopefully Cameron has the same steel balls that Thatcher had 12 years ago. We all need the Iron Lady right now."
I've gotta admit, I was never a fan of Thatcher, for a number of reasons (and starting up the cAGW scam is one of them, whether she later regretted it or not.)
But comparing Cameron with Thatcher is like comparing Daniel O'Donnell with Michael Collins.
I think that's my favourite picture of the year...
How many nuclear, and gas-, coal-, and oil-fired power stations failed in the adverse weather conditions yesterday..?
Count them........... Oh, there weren't any...
edward getty
Yes, you are right. The politicians are the puppets, the EPP the strings and just who are the puppet masters? Well, who has benefited? First of all, big finance. That is what is behind "saving the banks". Then there are those who sell the green machines. Others? Perhaps big oil, but I don't see that, unless there is a hidden link, which may exists.
If you want to simplify the naming, it is the Power Elite. But that is nothing new -- it's been around for millenia with the current crop first written about in the book The Power Elite written by the sociologist, C. Wright Mills, in 1956
Good review of the book here
DPdelaS
"The politicians are the puppets, the EPP the strings and just who are the puppet masters? Well, who has benefited? First of all, big finance..."
Wind turbine is owned by Infinis. Who owns Infinis - Terra Firma? Who are Terra Firma? You've already answered that but Google them anyway. Follow the money!
KevinUK
KevinUK
Exactly. Thank you for the example, although there are many Terra Firmas in google, I assume you mean
http://www.terrafirma.com/infinis-wrg.html.
Yeap, Power Elite wins again. I really understand what the "Occupy" kiddies are all upset about, but they need to sit in the door way of Congress, Parliament, and Terra Firma.
Martin Brumby
But comparing Cameron with Thatcher is like comparing Daniel O'Donnell with Michael Collins.
Interesting comparison, but Cameron really did do the right thing yesterday. That says nothing about his stance on green, but may be there is hope. If there is at Tobin Tax in the UK, The City will simply move to Geneva and Zurich. Take a look at the number of international companies already in Geneva and Zurich. BTW, about 10% of the British GDP is dependent on The City. It is second only to NYC.
On the other hand, my pocket politician, Enda Kenny, bent over and kissed the ring of Merkozy. There goes the 12% corporate tax and 50% of the Irish GDP. Ireland is very heavily dependent on all those corporations housed in Dublin. Remove the tax break and they will move. Sarkozy wants that to be to Paris. I might add that when you look carefully at the French corporate tax, it is effectively only 7.5%. Sarkozy in not a friend of English speaking people at all.
Enda, a member of the EPP, has proven himself a European before an Irishman.
Given the turmoil in European politics, it will be interesting to follow the stance UK takes on being Green. Gonna be an interesting three months coming up. The fighting has just begun and I have no idea who will win or loose -- beyond us poor punters who will be shafted regardless.
Don says: Remove the tax break and they will move. Sarkozy wants that to be to Paris.
The common thought here is that the businesses will not move to France but to Singapore, India or other low cost economies in Asia.
So, if that is true why phuck around with the tax rate.
The businesses will definitely not stay in Europe.
@Robinson
it could become the iconic and ironic photograph of the year!
Don Pablo
Thanks for the link to "The Power Elite." Quite depressing stuff. You simultaneously made and ruined my weekend...I have much reading to do, but it's not going to be very uplifting.
Radio 4 Today has just had a chap discussing the burning wind turbine. Virtually a one off, he said, just one or two others to be seen on YouTube, and all it needs is re-engineering to make it able to cope with the increased winds we are going to get because of climate change.
At that point I threw my coffee mug at the radio.....
Oh right. Wind machines failing in high winds are an exceptional hazard? I recall a documentary about the great storm back in the 80s: one part featured a several hundred year old windmill. Those running it were in a panic for several hours that part of the drive train would catch fire and burn the entire structure down. (Theere was so much force that the brakes were ineffective)
Thereby increasing the cost dramatically and making then even more uneconomic.
The proposal I saw on one of the spoof news websites for summoning a kraken to spin offshore turbines seems a more practical alternative.
'elf and safety issues?
http://news.stv.tv/scotland/west-central/286344-investigation-into-cause-of-wind-turbine-blaze-during-hurricane-force-storm/
I wonder if that standard precautionary measure had been explained at any wind turbine planning meetings, especially as the wind industry is working hard to reduce safety distances between homes and blade throwers as this seems to be a risk:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-south-scotland-16084013
Presumably the windmill's owners (or insurers) fully compensate everyone affected, inconvenienced and the costs of the emergency services?
Bruce, Woodentop, DaveS: Do you actually read the articles Bishop links?
The article says: "There are around 13 or 15 wind turbines in the farm above Ardrossan. They were all off today because of the high winds, so something has obviously shorted out and gone on fire."
Although there is danger of fire and/or structural failure if a turbine can't be shutdown in high wind, there is no indication that high winds were responsible for this particular fire.
Letter in the Telegraph today:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/letters
SIR – The report of a wind turbine exploding in the severe weather (December 9) was most apposite during the EU summit. One is an almost useless human invention, about which a lot of hot air is generated, and which explodes under stress. The other is a wind turbine.
Peter Walsh
I was saying what Sarkozy wants -- like most politicians, he lives in a make-believe world that he is all knowing and sapient, and he knows what is best for us poor punters who are only fit to serve him and the Power Elite. That is why we are building wind mills that tilt at us.
You are, as usual, absolutely correct. Best make certain that you kiddies learn Mandarin because that will soon replace English as the lingua franca of the world.
You know, I am curious what the Japanese and Chinese really think about the stupid things we in the West are doing to ourselves. I suspect that they are too polite to say.
just remember that India is becoming higer-cost...they are starting to move activity to Indo-China
Frank
Maybe a Denier snuck up and set it on fire. Yeah, and also cut down the other one reported above. Must have used cutting torch to do it. Maybe he set the fire with it too. Yeah, that must be what happened.
Dec 9, 2011 at 4:49 AM | Don Pablo de la Sierra
Yeh but who climbed up the other one and unbolted the wings during the storm?
and later this week a cyclone of 945mBar is due to pass across Scotland. This will likely develop winds in excess of those seen this last week.
Looks like we are in for a great game of skittles. Watching the panic from France should be very entertaining.
Perhaps Frank would like to rejoin us next weekend for the update?
But comparing Cameron with Thatcher is like comparing Daniel O'Donnell with Michael Collins.
More Pet Clarke with AC/DC.
Funny how in the 18th and 19th century
it was coal that powered the industrial revoloution and not windmills
or watermills
You can go to Norfolk and Sussex and see old windmills restored as historic monuments
do you think they will do the same with the wind farms of today
Plaudits to the (not-always-on-side) Sunday Times, who made the burning wind turbine Picture Of The Week - almost a double page spread, too..!